Arbor Vitae Press Info?
by BilboIt finally occured to me yesterday to "contact" Arbor Vitae Press, and ask them where they are located and what their telephone number is. So far, no answer. Perhaps others have had more success? It seems a trifle odd that a business would want to keep its location and phone number a secret. It would make the prospects of increasing business a little more difficult, I would think. But then I've never had much of a mind for business. This is no doubt one of those areas of human activity that is beyond the understanding of a mere philosopher.
April 6th, 2007 at 11:47 am
Well, their fax is in Phoenix (area code 480).
Comment by keiths — April 6, 2007 @ 11:47 am
April 6th, 2007 at 12:00 pm
Hmmm…I wonder if you can get an address from a fax number.
Comment by Bilbo — April 6, 2007 @ 12:00 pm
April 6th, 2007 at 12:36 pm
Ha, conspiracy! Now we know for a fact that Richard Dawkins, Mike Gene and Arbor Vitae Press do not exist.
Comment by inunison — April 6, 2007 @ 12:36 pm
April 6th, 2007 at 2:38 pm
I called information. They said (480) is in the Dallas, Texas area. But there was no listing for the fax number, and no listing for Arbor Vitae Press.
Comment by Bilbo — April 6, 2007 @ 2:38 pm
April 6th, 2007 at 4:17 pm
Comment by neddy — April 6, 2007 @ 4:17 pm
April 6th, 2007 at 4:27 pm
But Darwin wasn't the only nor the first to have a Tree of Life.
Comment by Bilbo — April 6, 2007 @ 4:27 pm
April 6th, 2007 at 4:31 pm
So Neddy, are you Enezio de Alme…whoever? And is there an English translation of your blog?
Comment by Bilbo — April 6, 2007 @ 4:31 pm
April 6th, 2007 at 5:05 pm
Currently, a flaming sword is guarding the Tree of Life. Therefore you have not been able to find it.
Comment by Douglas — April 6, 2007 @ 5:05 pm
April 6th, 2007 at 5:08 pm
No doubt that sword is interfering with their publishing the book, also.
Comment by Bilbo — April 6, 2007 @ 5:08 pm
April 6th, 2007 at 5:18 pm
Found that (480) fax number here: http://www.arborvitaepress.com...
The switchboard.com reverse lookup didn't find anything though.
Looking for Arborvitae Press in the "Find a Business" section of the switchboard gives:
Nada…
Did find this via Google though: http://www.machensoc.demon.co....
Wood, Jonathan
e-mail: thratheewoodz@hotmail.com
snail: BM Spellbound, London WC1N 3XX
Interests: produces irregular catalogues of interesting and obscure second-hand stock. Proprietor of the Arbor Vitae Press
Based in London, maybe?
Regards,
Half-arsed Sherlock
Comment by Rob R. — April 6, 2007 @ 5:18 pm
April 6th, 2007 at 5:22 pm
Area code 480 is for Phoenix, Arizona.
Comment by Jack — April 6, 2007 @ 5:22 pm
April 6th, 2007 at 5:36 pm
My goodness, if people are so upset by the delay, let me say this. As the author, I have been fully apprised of the situation. There are a lot of technical issues to getting a book properly done and technical glitches do happen. I am content to let them get the book done properly. The bottom line here is that if you are annoyed/upset by the delay, do as they suggest - get a refund and wait for the release to re-purchase. Either that or wait for it to come out when it comes out. Such is life.
Comment by MikeGene — April 6, 2007 @ 5:36 pm
April 6th, 2007 at 5:55 pm
Hi Mike,
I think there is a lot of frustration among everyone involved. You are frustrated that your book, which you have spent a lot of time on, is being delayed. And many ID supporters are frustrated because a book they are looking forward to hasn't arrived on time.
This involves more than money. Whether people have put down the payment in advance or not, they were expecting a book by 2006, and are right to want to know why this hasn't happened. I understand that a project as ambitious as yours can run into delays, but I think more information about the delays would have been preferable.
And to everyone else: You can get in touch with us here. If you have any questions to Mike about the book, submit them, and I'll make sure he gets them.
Comment by Krauze — April 6, 2007 @ 5:55 pm
April 6th, 2007 at 6:02 pm
A book on a subject considered by most to be of questionable merit, by a pseudonymous author, from a mysterious publisher, that is six months overdue…where's Alfred E. Newman when you need him?
Comment by Bilbo — April 6, 2007 @ 6:02 pm
April 6th, 2007 at 6:19 pm
What? Me worry? Take your pick:
http://images.google.com/image...
Comment by Bilbo — April 6, 2007 @ 6:19 pm
April 6th, 2007 at 6:22 pm
LOL. Don't forget the book has no forward from any ID player, has not been reviewed by any ID player, and has no endorsements.
The book has only one hope - the appeal of its arguments.
Comment by MikeGene — April 6, 2007 @ 6:22 pm
April 6th, 2007 at 6:26 pm
Wait…a book that hasn't been published, yet, has hope?
Comment by Bilbo — April 6, 2007 @ 6:26 pm
April 6th, 2007 at 6:31 pm
Of course - the arguments.
Comment by MikeGene — April 6, 2007 @ 6:31 pm
April 6th, 2007 at 6:55 pm
The arguments that we haven't read?
Comment by Bilbo — April 6, 2007 @ 6:55 pm
April 6th, 2007 at 7:03 pm
Sure. From your perspective, they do not exist (although you can get a feel for a few of them from this site). But they do exist and I know they exist because …… I am their author.
Comment by MikeGene — April 6, 2007 @ 7:03 pm
April 6th, 2007 at 7:07 pm
Teleologic has always been one of my favorite sites. And I've suspected that your book (if there is one) would have much the same "feel" to it. But I'm losing faith, Mike. I'm losing faith. I may soon become an Ornery…what should we label one who disbelieves in your book?
Comment by Bilbo — April 6, 2007 @ 7:07 pm
April 6th, 2007 at 7:15 pm
Which would be yet another reason why the book has only one hope - its arguments. Those arguments will now also have to win even you back over to the Forces of Darkness!
Don't worry, there is a book. Ten chapters with approximately 100,000 words, seven Tables, 29 Figures, and almost 300 references/footnotes. Heck, I practically have it memorized by now.
Comment by MikeGene — April 6, 2007 @ 7:15 pm
April 6th, 2007 at 7:17 pm
There is only one name for those who disbelieve in The Design Matrix:
Blue pillars.
Comment by Krauze — April 6, 2007 @ 7:17 pm
April 6th, 2007 at 7:20 pm
But I thought I already swallowed the red pill. Didn't I? Or did I just dream that I swallowed the red pill.
Comment by Bilbo — April 6, 2007 @ 7:20 pm
April 6th, 2007 at 7:22 pm
OK, so I'm gonna' become an Ornery Blue Pillar.
Comment by Bilbo — April 6, 2007 @ 7:22 pm
April 6th, 2007 at 7:28 pm
Mike,
Does too.
Comment by Douglas — April 6, 2007 @ 7:28 pm
April 6th, 2007 at 7:29 pm
Mike,
I believe "forward" should be spelled, "foreword". (Just in case you are also the book's editor.)
Comment by Douglas — April 6, 2007 @ 7:29 pm
April 6th, 2007 at 8:03 pm
Yes, I am Enezio E. de Almeida Filho, aka Neddy. I don't plan to have an English version of my blog. I am a former atheist marxist-leninist, and an ID proponent in Brazil.
Comment by neddy — April 6, 2007 @ 8:03 pm
April 6th, 2007 at 9:41 pm
Bemvindo Enezio. Eu gosto de ler seu blog. Ha muitos IDers no Brasil?
Comment by Bradford — April 6, 2007 @ 9:41 pm
April 6th, 2007 at 9:52 pm
Okay, more random mutations of a word-processor. No design, and no detectable meaning. Further evidence that English is the only real language.
Comment by Douglas — April 6, 2007 @ 9:52 pm
April 6th, 2007 at 10:24 pm
You could just post the text on your blog, it would be a lot faster. C'mon…just hit CTRL-C, then ALT-TAB, then CTRL-V…problem solved!
Comment by Nick Matzke — April 6, 2007 @ 10:24 pm
April 7th, 2007 at 12:01 am
Douglas:
I like that Douglas. That pretty much summarizes Darwinism. Some random typewriter strokes, an unexplained selection process and shazam: out comes a new language.
Comment by Bradford — April 7, 2007 @ 12:01 am
April 7th, 2007 at 8:40 am
Bradford and all TTists:
Thanks for the welcome. Yes, we have a lot of IDers in Brazil. A few university professors, and undergraduate and graduate students. Thus far, due to possible retaliation from the Scientific Nomenklatura, we are an underground movement in campi. That's why my blog is entitled Defying the Scientific Nomenklatura.
Comment by neddy — April 7, 2007 @ 8:40 am
April 7th, 2007 at 9:25 am
Hi neddy,
But we have been told that ID is something that is particular to the United States. You mean we have been misled???
Comment by MikeGene — April 7, 2007 @ 9:25 am
April 7th, 2007 at 10:10 am
Mike,
Don't you see? The cancer that is ID has spread from the U.S., its vile carrier, to other countries. It's devastating and horrible. Gives me nightmares.
Comment by Douglas — April 7, 2007 @ 10:10 am
April 7th, 2007 at 10:13 am
Neddy, could you trace a brief history of ID in Brazil and link it to any events that occured outside Brazil?
Comment by Bradford — April 7, 2007 @ 10:13 am
April 7th, 2007 at 10:13 am
Yes, you American people have been misled by the SN and mainstream media: ID is a worldwide phenomena. Keep up the good work, and I hope to buy your virtual book pretty soon. LOL!
Comment by neddy — April 7, 2007 @ 10:13 am
April 7th, 2007 at 10:22 am
Douglas:
There is nothing more powerful than an idea whose time has come Douglas. Ideas are no respectors of differences in culture, language or national boundaries. Anti-IDers invent their own memes to put ID in an unfavorable light. Then they are caught off-guard by actual events. Memes can become mechanisms for self-deception.
Comment by Bradford — April 7, 2007 @ 10:22 am
April 7th, 2007 at 12:11 pm
Red Pillar: Someone who is willing to act upon or believe in a reality that is not commonly accepted. That is what I do in regards to ID. That is different than blindly accepting the word of a pseudonymous blogger on the internet. I'm reaching the point where I will no longer accept the idea that Mike Gene has written a book, and will soon start using the "W" word when refering to him.
There are a few options, any one of which would restore my faith in Mike:
1) As Nick suggested, post part of your book on-line. You could even charge a subscription for us to read it.
2) Give us the location and phone number of the publisher.
3) Have Dembski or Behe — both of whom claim to know you personally — testify that you have indeed written such a book.
4) Reveal your identity.
5) Publish the book.
One of these or some other reasonable alternative will do. Otherwise, I may be forced to start using "wanker" for Mike's middle name.
Comment by Bilbo — April 7, 2007 @ 12:11 pm
April 7th, 2007 at 12:18 pm
Hi Bilbo,
I don't know whether you're being tongue-in-cheek, but having reviewed some of the chapters, I can testify that Mike has indeed written a book.
Comment by Krauze — April 7, 2007 @ 12:18 pm
April 7th, 2007 at 12:34 pm
Krauze:
Great! Testimony to the truthfulness of a pseudonymous blogger from another pseudonymous blogger! Care to reveal your true identity?
And No. I'm not being tongue-in-cheek.
Comment by Bilbo — April 7, 2007 @ 12:34 pm
April 7th, 2007 at 12:43 pm
Hi Bilbo,
If I were asked to judge your honesty, I wouldn't ask about what name you go by in circles where I have never heard of you. Instead, I would look at the record of what you have done and said in the forum where I knew you best: Telic Thoughts.
Besides, if you're worried about your money, just do what Mike suggested and get a refund.
Comment by Krauze — April 7, 2007 @ 12:43 pm
April 7th, 2007 at 12:49 pm
Guts:
Hippitus hoppitus, amen.
Comment by Joy — April 7, 2007 @ 12:49 pm
April 7th, 2007 at 12:55 pm
Hi Bilbo,
Ah, a classic "evidence vs. faith" debate. On one hand, the evidence before your eyes causes you to doubt the Existence of The Book. You choose the Blue Pill - a subject considered by most to be of questionable merit, by a pseudonymous author, from a mysterious publisher, that is six months overdue. The evidence is clear "“ The Book does not exist. If you had to choose the Red Pill, you would have to rely on faith. So what shall lead you to the truth? Faith? Or Evidence?
Only time will tell.
Comment by MikeGene — April 7, 2007 @ 12:55 pm
April 7th, 2007 at 3:26 pm
Mike "Wanker" Gene - it just doesn't roll off the tongue. But, if no book is forthcoming by, say, the end of the year, and none of Bilbo's other suggestions for verifying faith in Mike, I will succumb and withdraw my endorsement of his book.
Comment by Douglas — April 7, 2007 @ 3:26 pm
April 7th, 2007 at 3:27 pm
Bilbo Says:
Come on. We already know how that will turn out. Dembski will back out at the last minute, and Behe's testimony will bring disrepute upon the whole enterprise.
Comment by RogerRabbitt — April 7, 2007 @ 3:27 pm
April 7th, 2007 at 4:27 pm
Jeez Bilbo get a grip. Let ID enrich you, not engulf you.
Comment by Guts — April 7, 2007 @ 4:27 pm
April 7th, 2007 at 6:03 pm
That was a good line RogerRabbit.:lol:
Comment by Bradford — April 7, 2007 @ 6:03 pm
April 7th, 2007 at 6:46 pm
I stand behind every word of my endorsement.
Comment by Pez — April 7, 2007 @ 6:46 pm
April 7th, 2007 at 8:10 pm
Bradford wrote:
Neddy, could you trace a brief history of ID in Brazil and link it to any events that occured outside Brazil?
In my first post I forgot to mention that I was an evolutionist till 1998, but after reading Michael Behe's Darwin's Black Box [Brazilian Portuguese translation], I woke up from my epistemic slumbers. If Darwin's theory of evolution couldn't explain a "simple" bacterial flagellum then Dobzhansky's cliche "nothing in biology makes sense except by the light of evolution" doesn't hold water. I didn't know anybody from Discovery Institute at that time.
Later on I read Michael Denton's "Evolution: A Theory in Crisis", and one by Dr. Newton Freire-Maia, a well-known Brazilian evolutionist scientist, "Teoria da Evolução "“ De Darwin a Teoria Sintética" [Theory of Evolution "“ From Darwin to the Synthetic Theory]. This Brazilian author highlighted the anomalies that neo-Darwinism doesn't explain.
As an educator, I knew then that something had to be done. I wrote letters and e-mails to newspapers and magazines science editors pointing out that something novel and revolutionary was going to bring a paradigm shift. They mocked me and the IDT. I decided to apply to a master degree in Education in a well-known private Brazilian university. My project was a bit similar to Jonathan Well's "Icons of Evolution". My project was rejected, but I got no negative remarks on it.
In 1998 we started a small group of Darwin's dissidents in Piracicaba, Sao Paulo, and since then we have a few professors, graduate and undergarduate students who are IDists because of scientific evidences. Since there is no academic freedom in Brazil for someone dissenting from Darwin, we decided to go underground and to promote ID this way. Our ID group is truly Brazilian, and has no financial support from Discovery Institute.
Comment by neddy — April 7, 2007 @ 8:10 pm
April 7th, 2007 at 9:02 pm
Thanks Neddy. I too was influenced by Darwin's Black Box. Despite attempts to refute irreducible complexity I note that proposed pathways invoke homologous proteins and proposed precursor systems consisting largely of such proteins. However, there is a vagueness to them that is unsatisfying to me.
By the way, where did you learn English?
Comment by Bradford — April 7, 2007 @ 9:02 pm
April 7th, 2007 at 9:10 pm
Pez,
I'll bet you do. Where is it, by the way?
Never mind. Found it:
Comment by Douglas — April 7, 2007 @ 9:10 pm
April 8th, 2007 at 4:13 am
Bilbo wrote:
Not such a good idea.
In November of 2000, Dembski challenged all of us to read Paul Nelson's monograph:
Over six years later, it still hasn't been published.
Comment by keiths — April 8, 2007 @ 4:13 am
April 8th, 2007 at 7:20 am
Bradford:
You asked me where I learned English: it was part of my marxist-leninist training to learn English in order to find out what WASPS were doing in Brazil back in the 1960s. I think it paid well, but not like Che Guevara and Castro had in mind.
Comment by neddy — April 8, 2007 @ 7:20 am
April 8th, 2007 at 9:41 am
Hi Mike,
I think it's best to take the time to get everything right before releasing the book to the wolves–I mean world.
Comment by KC — April 8, 2007 @ 9:41 am
April 8th, 2007 at 5:16 pm
Mike,
I'm sure you've got enough data for quantifying the probability of the book being ready for shipment by such and such a date. Maybe you could do such an analysis for the following dates, thus increasing your scientific credibility:
1. April 15th
2. May 1st
3. May 15th
4. June 1st
5. July 1st
6. August 1st
7. October 1st
8. December 31st
Comment by bipod — April 8, 2007 @ 5:16 pm
April 9th, 2007 at 10:51 am
Mike, if your book makes as big a splash as I think it will, what will you do if a media storm develops? What type of impact are you expecting and how do you plan to deal with it?
Comment by Mertens — April 9, 2007 @ 10:51 am
April 9th, 2007 at 5:03 pm
keiths:
The difference is that even though it isn't published, Paul Nelson probably wrote it. In Mike Gene's case, I no longer believe he has written anything. I think this is all a very bad practical joke on Mike W. Gene's part. All he would have to do is get Dembski to say he's actually written it. The fact that Mike won't is proof to me that he hasn't written a thing.
Comment by Bilbo — April 9, 2007 @ 5:03 pm
April 9th, 2007 at 5:29 pm
Bilbo - let's raise the stakes, shall we? Perhaps you should make a bet with MikeGene that he hasn't written the book. He's said it will come out this year…
Comment by Wonders For Oyarsa — April 9, 2007 @ 5:29 pm
April 9th, 2007 at 5:39 pm
I got a C-note that says Mike Gene wrote it. I mean C'mon guys…
Got another on that says MG's book drives the NCSE (and likewise "pro-science" pundits) to hysterics. Assuming, of course, that that level of irrationality wrt ID has not already been achieved by the 'pro-science conspiracy theorist' crowd. No bet on that.
Comment by Rob R. — April 9, 2007 @ 5:39 pm
April 9th, 2007 at 6:50 pm
I wager there's a rabbit on the back cover.
Comment by Douglas — April 9, 2007 @ 6:50 pm
April 9th, 2007 at 9:30 pm
Hi Bilbo,
Oh, oh. But neither Dembski, Behe, nor any other ID player has seen the manuscript. Hmmm. This would appear to support the "pro-evidence" position of the Blue Pillars. Faith is on trial.
Comment by MikeGene — April 9, 2007 @ 9:30 pm
April 9th, 2007 at 9:36 pm
Hi Mertens,
It's difficult for me to envision any "media storm." Remember that Mike Behe's book is coming out in June, so it's not like there will be a lack of new ID-related material to gather interest.
Comment by MikeGene — April 9, 2007 @ 9:36 pm
April 9th, 2007 at 9:42 pm
Hi Rob,
Well, it would be good for sales. The worst thing that can happen to a book on a subject considered by most to be of questionable merit, by a pseudonymous author, from a mysterious publisher, that is six months overdue, is that it gets ignored.
Comment by MikeGene — April 9, 2007 @ 9:42 pm
April 9th, 2007 at 9:56 pm
Hi Mike,
Good point[s]…
Also. any more delays and you and Behe's new book will be competing for the same audience. Also, any ideas on what the hold up is and/or when it'll be resolved, that you could share with us?
Regards.
Comment by Rob R. — April 9, 2007 @ 9:56 pm
April 9th, 2007 at 10:15 pm
It's OK, Mike - you can tell us plainly what the trouble is. It's just us, your friends. It'll just be our little secret…
(pay no attention to the internet behind the curtain)
Comment by Wonders For Oyarsa — April 9, 2007 @ 10:15 pm
April 9th, 2007 at 11:46 pm
Yup, mum's the word…
Seriously though, what sort of glitches are typical in book production/distribution?… I haven't a clue. You write it, they mass produce it and ship it out.
Easy.
No? Why would it not be a good idea to say "Hey guys sorry but we were just about to ship it an realized we had all the page numbers upside down." or "Yeah sorry there's a bunch of graphs and pictures of rabbits and such… we just ran out of ink."
Delivery truck caught a flat…
Why so secretive? Or is there more to this than my limited intellect is capable of cypherin' on its own.
Comment by Rob R. — April 9, 2007 @ 11:46 pm
April 9th, 2007 at 11:52 pm
Hi Rob,
Well let's hope the target audience doesn't get tapped out with one book.
But seriously, I have pondered this and here is how I see it. If someone thinks Behe's book is impressive, it will simply create a hunger for more. If someone does not think it is impressive, it will create a hunger for something else. It's hard to see the downside. What will be funny is whether there are any conspiracy theorists out there who think there is some form of coordination.
It's just the technical stuff that comes with polishing a manuscript and dealing with a difficult author. KC nailed it.
Comment by MikeGene — April 9, 2007 @ 11:52 pm
April 10th, 2007 at 12:27 am
Thanks Mike,
I was assuming you'd already turned over the finished product to the publisher and the delay was due to technical issues on their end… instead of being due to "polishing" the arguments/writing.
Makes more sense now.
Not givin' ya a hard time here; I fully expect it will come out eventually. May 13th was my official guess… so take your time and I get a free copy. That was a signed copy too, right?
Regards
Comment by Rob R. — April 10, 2007 @ 12:27 am
April 10th, 2007 at 12:48 am
Hi Rob,
The manuscript was indeed finished and turned over. I'm the one who gunked up the works by insisting on some significant last minute changes in a process where last minute changes are not usually done. That threw a big ol' monkey wrench into the whole process, so frustration should be aimed my way. And if I had it my way, I would probably make another round of last minute changes:shock:, but don't worry, I'm done meddling.
Comment by MikeGene — April 10, 2007 @ 12:48 am
April 10th, 2007 at 4:17 am
Apparently, Gramma's fussiness runs in the Genes.
Comment by Douglas — April 10, 2007 @ 4:17 am
April 10th, 2007 at 10:38 am
Mike,
The nice thing about the internet is that you can use your blog to make post-publication corrections/clarifications that might be incorporated into a second edition printing.
Comment by bipod — April 10, 2007 @ 10:38 am
April 10th, 2007 at 11:12 am
Hi Mike,
I could be all wet here, but I am betting that your book will fill a certain and needed niche. From my perspecive most ID books grow out of the political movement against Darwinism. This creates a certain tenor or stridency and also gets the book a certain labeling. I am hoping and think that your book will generally avoid that battle and just address the topic at hand-that some things give evidence of design.
Comment by bj — April 10, 2007 @ 11:12 am
April 10th, 2007 at 2:26 pm
Can't we at least see a table of contents?
Comment by Raevmo — April 10, 2007 @ 2:26 pm
April 10th, 2007 at 5:16 pm
Raevmo,
Isn't that a bit like asking to see the bride before she's ready to walk down the aisle?
Comment by Douglas — April 10, 2007 @ 5:16 pm
April 10th, 2007 at 6:11 pm
Would you agree to walk down the isle without a glimpse of the contents? I wouldn't.
Comment by Raevmo — April 10, 2007 @ 6:11 pm
April 10th, 2007 at 6:24 pm
I mean aisle.
Comment by Raevmo — April 10, 2007 @ 6:24 pm
April 10th, 2007 at 6:26 pm
If we keep this analogy up, people are going to think that highly anticipated books are like arranged marriages.
Comment by thechristiancynic — April 10, 2007 @ 6:26 pm
April 10th, 2007 at 6:38 pm
Table of contents, I think, are listed in the Flash animation. Not sure though.
Comment by bipod — April 10, 2007 @ 6:38 pm