ID critic worries about "creato-terrorism"
by Krauze… if by "terrorism" you mean vague threats against no one in particular:
"There were no overt threats to anybody specifically by name," [police commander Brad] Wiesley said. "It basically said anybody who doesn't believe in our religious belief is wrong and should be taken care of."
In case you read this post, expecting to see something about real terrorism, here's a little story, from less than two weeks ago:
Animal-Rights Militants Say They Put Bomb Under UCLA Scientist's Car
In another attempted attack on a UCLA professor by animal-rights extremists, federal and local authorities are investigating the placement of a bomb on Sunday under a car belonging to an eye researcher at the university. The explosive failed to detonate, according to today's Los Angeles Times. The incident resembles one last summer, in which activists claimed to have tried to bomb the residence of another researcher at the University of California at Los Angeles. That explosive also failed to blow up, and it was left at the wrong house in any event.
July 12th, 2007 at 2:05 pm
Krauze, don't be ignorant. Everybody knows that creationists are the biggest threat to science and scientists.
Comment by macht — July 12, 2007 @ 2:05 pm
July 12th, 2007 at 2:39 pm
Well, it must be, as it's the only kind of terrorism ever mentioned by pro-science blogs like Panda's Thumb.
Comment by Krauze — July 12, 2007 @ 2:39 pm
July 12th, 2007 at 3:05 pm
Yeah, what a laugh that people working in an ecology & evolution department got threatened. The pathetic winers didn't even get really killed.
There are evolutionary biology departments in the US that don't call themselves that way (but rather things like "department of integrative biology"). One wonders why.
Comment by Raevmo — July 12, 2007 @ 3:05 pm
July 12th, 2007 at 4:36 pm
Raevmo Says:
I don't know where you get this stuff from. No college or university department is afraid of Christians enough to purge the word "evolution" from its name. It's never been such, even when the U.S. was more openly Christian than it is now.
Besides, you're not even American; the only things you've heard about the U.S. get to you through very grainy filters.
Comment by angryoldfatman — July 12, 2007 @ 4:36 pm
July 12th, 2007 at 4:39 pm
Hey look there was an edit button there the whole time (ignore this comment or chuck it down the memory hole).
Comment by angryoldfatman — July 12, 2007 @ 4:39 pm
July 12th, 2007 at 5:14 pm
Seems to me that religious people in America are far more likely to get their churches burned or bombed and meetings attacked by shooters than any Darwinist lab.
Here is a church burning from just last week.
Comment by Jehu — July 12, 2007 @ 5:14 pm
July 12th, 2007 at 5:20 pm
Here is another swell church arson from June 20th.
Comment by Jehu — July 12, 2007 @ 5:20 pm
July 12th, 2007 at 5:42 pm
Instead of each group screaming that it is the real victim, why don't we all denounce violence by any group? I hereby denounce verbal threats of violence, or actual acts of violence against biologists or scientists, because they disagree with Creationism or Intelligent Design. I call upon all Creationists and ID supporters to denounce any such incidents. We must engender an atmosphere of respect for those we disagree with, not an atmosphere of hostility.
Comment by Bilbo — July 12, 2007 @ 5:42 pm
July 12th, 2007 at 5:58 pm
Hear, hear! That's the best thing I've read all day.
Comment by thechristiancynic — July 12, 2007 @ 5:58 pm
July 12th, 2007 at 5:58 pm
What incidents? Have there been any? If so, I denounce them.
Church burnings are real. Violence against biologists is a myth.
Comment by Jehu — July 12, 2007 @ 5:58 pm
July 12th, 2007 at 6:35 pm
Jehu, not sure if you followed links, but there is a legitimate news report of threats to an ecology and evolutionary biology lab in Boulder, CO. I think that moves it out of "myth" status.
Comment by thechristiancynic — July 12, 2007 @ 6:35 pm
July 12th, 2007 at 8:08 pm
The fat angry dude:
I used to work as a postdoc in the US and in Canada, and I still visit the US about five times a year, so my filters may not be as grainy as you think. I have asked American colleagues why they didn't call their departments Evolutionary Biology, and they said it would be bad for business. Now why would that be?
Comment by Raevmo — July 12, 2007 @ 8:08 pm
July 12th, 2007 at 8:35 pm
Bilbo
Yes Yes Yes Right on Bilbo!!
Comment by William Brookfield — July 12, 2007 @ 8:35 pm
July 12th, 2007 at 9:02 pm
I might add , fat dude, that I admire the US a lot, and I like the friendly people over there very much, but your country is being royally f***ed over by a gang of totally immoral creeps right now and it worries me a lot.
Comment by Raevmo — July 12, 2007 @ 9:02 pm
July 12th, 2007 at 9:27 pm
Raevmo Says:
I am skeptical of your claim. I remain unconvinced until better evidence is presented.
Raevmo Says Later:
That's great, but that has nothing to do with the subject at hand, unless your future evidence has something about the "immoral creeps" changing biology department names or bombing American and British biologists. I realize that calling your bluff has made you emotional, but please try to stay focused.
Bilbo Says:
I agree and add that I denounce any violence or threats of violence against anyone who merely agrees or disagrees with a particular political or religious view.
I may not like what someone else says or how they think, but I wholeheartedly agree that they should have the unfettered right to say or think those things. I also should have the right to ignore those things and tell my children to ignore those things.
Comment by angryoldfatman — July 12, 2007 @ 9:27 pm
July 12th, 2007 at 9:38 pm
Oh, I thought that was Iraq.
Comment by onething — July 12, 2007 @ 9:38 pm
July 12th, 2007 at 9:42 pm
onething Says:
He didn't say his postdoc work was in geography.
Comment by angryoldfatman — July 12, 2007 @ 9:42 pm
July 12th, 2007 at 10:06 pm
christiansynic,
The officer in the news report says, "There were no overt threats to anybody specifically by name,"
So "no overt threats" is real violence? Is there a new definition of violence that I am not aware of? What kind of politically correct dope have you been smoking?
Comment by Jehu — July 12, 2007 @ 10:06 pm
July 13th, 2007 at 12:24 pm
Jehu, get off your high horse. For your benefit, here's what Bilbo said:
The referent "any such incidents" was to both threats of violence and acts of violence. (Bilbo did say "verbal threats", but I would assume that written threats are just as valid for his statement.) Because you referenced the last statement, which refers to both, I figured you were talking about either threats or actual violence and happened to overlook your statement "Violence against biologists is a myth" (which, by the way, in its unqualified form is probably false - I'm sure people beat up biologists just like they do every other subset of the population). But of course, you had to take what I said rather uncharitably. Wonderful example, don't you think?
Comment by thechristiancynic — July 13, 2007 @ 12:24 pm
July 13th, 2007 at 12:44 pm
"(Bilbo did say "verbal threats", but I would assume that written threats are just as valid for his statement.)"
"Verbal" simply means "using words," so written and oral threats are both verbal. Even sign language, as long as the gestures convey words, is verbal.
Comment by JAM — July 13, 2007 @ 12:44 pm
July 13th, 2007 at 1:57 pm
While that is etymologically true, 'verbal' can sometimes be used to signify an oral transmission as opposed to a written one. Just covering my bases here.
Comment by thechristiancynic — July 13, 2007 @ 1:57 pm
July 13th, 2007 at 2:35 pm
Just to help Bilbo cover the bases, I'm confident that Bilbo denounces any threats conveyed by sign language or cartoons, too.
Comment by JAM — July 13, 2007 @ 2:35 pm
July 13th, 2007 at 2:47 pm
JAM Says:
Just to one-up everybody, I denounce threats conveyed by puppet theater. TAKE THAT PUNCH AND JUDY.
Comment by angryoldfatman — July 13, 2007 @ 2:47 pm
July 14th, 2007 at 2:24 pm
Wrong again friends. The kook Menacher "Michael" Korn is a 49-year-old Israeli national and former Messianic Jew who says he was baptized into Christianity in the Sea of Galilee seven years ago and is now on a mission to convert Jews and Muslims. His blog, JesusOverIsrael. blogspot.com, references CU-Boulder specifically and says he lives in Denver, although he has a North Carolina area code. has been identified. Quackery is at best mendacious, like when Scott Minnich discussing the 'evidence for evolution' flubs about the "fossil record". When it comes to these antics, ID/Neocreationism is not a patch on its older cousin true blue creationism! Rob Crowther just stuck his foot in the mouth.
Comment by agam — July 14, 2007 @ 2:24 pm
July 14th, 2007 at 6:57 pm
What does this mean???
Comment by Bradford — July 14, 2007 @ 6:57 pm
July 15th, 2007 at 12:03 am
Bradford,
Check out the DI's peer-edited blog, where if they haven't taken it down Rob Crowther can be seen scoffing at the threats to the CU profs.
Comment by agam — July 15, 2007 @ 12:03 am